Last Saturday, I was invited to a exhibition held by Jardin Smith International, a local company that sells UK land to investors in Singapore and other countries. Jardin Smith International holds these kinds of events quite frequently, each time at a different venue. In my case, it was held at Ritz Carlton Hotel. I have not been to Ritz before, so it took me a while to find the place.
Upon arrival, I was greeted by a client relationship manager (or salesperson), whose job was to make me feel comfortable and explain to me the concept of how it all works. So I was treated to some free food and there was the usual idle talk before we got down into business.
Having already been to a presentation by another company that sells UK land, I was familiar with the concept. Here’s how it works:
- The company purchases a plot of greenbelt land. This is land that cannot be developed unless it is rezoned (a process known as getting planning permission) by the government.
- The land is sub-divided into many smaller plots and sold to investors.
- The company retains 25% of the land so that it is also “vested” along with the investors.
- The company goes out to apply for planning permission. This process will take many years. As such, this is more of a long term investment. We are told this would take five to ten years at the minimum.
- Once planning permission is obtained, the value of the land will rise 5-10 times (from your purchase price) and you can realise your gains when the entire site is sold. In Jardin Smith International’s case, 60% of the owners will have to agree before it can be sold.
The reasons why we should investing in UK land (as told by the company) are as follows:
- UK has a housing problem and land will only become lesser and lesser.
- The price of land has been increasing steadily (About 20-fold in the last 15 years).
- 2012 Summer Olympics will be held in London and this will have positive effect on the property market.
The plot on offer by Jardin was being sold for a cool $30,000. An initial deposit of 10% was required and could be paid by credit card. The balance could be paid by credit card and UOB cardholders could even pay by interest-free 12 months installment plans.
I politely told the client relationship manager that I didn’t have the money at the moment and wasn’t interested. She was quite persistent and even suggested I just pay the deposit first. I wasn’t going to do that since I won’t be able to finance the remaining 90%. She was pretty disappointed and made a last ditch effort to ask me for referrals. Of course I would not refer any of my friends to a company that I had not fully researched on.
Tomorrow, I will write about some of the things you need to be aware of if you are
investing in UK land.
See also Dangers of UK Land Banking.
Besides the land investment, there was also a side booth promoting a property City House, Croydon in London. According to the person I spoke to, he was helping some investment fund sell off their units.
1-bedroom units were available for about 215,000 GBP and 2-bedroom units for 250,000 GBP. 12% of the amount would be payable within 28 days, another 13% due at completion (end 2009) and the remaining 75% can be bank financed by Lloyds.
The rental yields are estimated at 5% and if the units are rental out, it would be able to cover the interest payments. It looked interesting to me but being not very inexperienced in this area (other than the fact that I can’t really afford it now), I decided to give it a miss.
255 comments
1 ping
Helen says:
November 14, 2010 at 9:10 pm (UTC 8)
Angela and David,
As you claim to be investors with JSI yourselves, do you know others who have invested in this as well? When I attended the talk at OU hotel yesterday, the salesperson tried to persuade me by giving examples of many who have invested previously. As none of my friends or anyone that I know of have done this before, I find that a little bit not too convincing. If it is indeed quite lucrative and profitable, why aren’t many people doing this? Also, it just hit me that I do not any of those who have invested in this themselves! Please, could you share with me, whether the info they have updated you with is credible? Also, is any of you getting your returns back anytime soon? I asked many questions at the event, and they told me that JSI had 4 previous projects, i.e. Birmingham, Durham, Southampton, and Surrey. Surrey being the earliest one in 2006 has just been rezoned according to JSI and they are looking into selling it off to a prospective developer in the region of 2011. I wish to know David, as you indicated that you invested in their first project, whether you were told that you will get the return soon? Is this true?
FYI, I bought a plot, with the hope to make something out of it. The fact that Gerrards Cross is next to an already-developed area, close to the vicinity of the railway lines, next to the M25 ring highway, seems quite convincing to be a potential land for development.
I’m quite confused by the earlier comments here. Steve, I appreciate your concern by highlighting all the possibilities of it being a type of scam, and for pointing out reliable sources as the local authorities’ plans etc. However, I would like to double check with you, (by now I feel that you’re quite an expert in this field) what I read in the latest report by South Bucks (as there were too many previous reports, I just read the latest one, July 2010, updated and amended in Oct 2010), it says on page 35 that Gerrards Cross is indeed a plot of land in the focus for development. http://www.southbucks.gov.uk/includes/documents/cm_docs/2010/c/cd_36consolidatedversion2.pdf
How long it will take for the development, I do not know, as like the first few reports have it that it can only be developed earliest in 2026. However, some reports, ie the July 2010 indicates that development should take place from 2006 to period of around 2026? I am quite confused here.
With all due respect to all of the above comments by both seemingly quite credible and some seemingly libel, I wonder who’s who here- whether some are in the guise of the real estate company themselves to try to stop all the truth from spreading, especially to the poor investors who are really trying to earn some money here. DLEW, you made many points there, if they’re valid points,I am finished, as I don’t think i can get my deposit back. Half of me is telling me to go ahead, half of me, I am feeling wobbly in my knees.
STEVE, what you mentioned in your first post is spot-on. How did you know about wht they said exactly? I am quite afraid now. And NO, this is not a dumping ground for Singaporeans, I think Malaysians too reads this.
Would help if anyone else who attended this weekend’s event can share their experience. Any other investors?
In Malaysia, several companies have been raided by the Companies’ Commission in Malaysia for land banking. http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2008/10/25/nation/20081025132723&sec=nation
Someone, please tell me whether JSI is genuine or not?
Thanks.
Louis says:
November 17, 2010 at 7:10 pm (UTC 8)
Helen,
I bought a plot of the Surrey project back in 2007, and I seldom heard anything from them other than times when they want to sell me another plot in another project
I am really glad to hear the news from you and hope it is true:
“Surrey being the earliest one in 2006 has just been rezoned according to JSI and they are looking into selling it off to a prospective developer in the region of 2011.”
So far I have not heard anything from JSI and I do hope I can see some returns in 2011/12 time frame.
Steve F says:
November 26, 2010 at 1:50 pm (UTC 8)
Well i seem to have upset some people so let me try and respond to some comments made.
[Angela P] Isnt it better that you hear from them and keep you in the loop compared to you having to call them up constantly asking for updates after not hearing from them on months on end or even years?]
Investments are not about customer care free gifts drinks parties or social events. If you get them you are paying for them as a cost of your investment. The only real measure of investments is their actual value when you cash out. Ask any Madoff investor who had the thrill of seeing their investment grow month by month year by year on paper but could not cash out. On a Scale of 1 – 10 what are your chances of cashing out at either a profit or at all ?
[Angela P, Helen, Louis] Surrey being the earliest one in 2006 has just been rezoned according to JSI and they are looking into selling it off to a prospective developer in the region of 2011]
Can you name the site in Surrey. If you mean Shrimps Field, Brighton Rd, Kingswood, Surrey then rezoning has removed this site from any possibility for development. Shrimps Field site was rejected for development due to open space deficiency. This has already been detailed in several web sites. I can post a link if the website owner allows it.
[Angela P] Yes i agree you are paying a higher amount than what the company paid for it, but isnt that how bussiness works?]
Are we talking about business or investing? If I sell you a S$2 note for S$30 as a business and you derive value from that note (maybe you like the serial number) then I make money and you are happy. If I sell the $2 note to you for $30 as an investment then you would be better off leaving the $30 in a shoebox under the bed. If you are buying this green belt land as an investment I have already explained why it is a bad one. The land cannot be converted for building so you cannot get rich that way. You are paying too much for the land to protect against annual inflation gains. The true land value will not pass the value of leaving the money in the shoe box for 40-50 years. The shoe box money is always available to you.
[Angela P] One bad experience by one person doesn’t paint a fair picture of the overall market or to future/ current investors.]
Name one UK land banking plot that has been offered to investors in Singapore that has converted for planning permission including those offered by JSI. Don’t name the general area name the plot. There are none. No land plots currently being offered have any prospect for development. This is not one bad experience. There are around 100 land banking companies that have failed or been shut down in the UK and several have been shut down in Singapore. This is an epidemic unfortunately.
[Helen] it says on page 35 that Gerrards Cross is indeed a plot of land in the focus for development.]
Facts:-
Gerrards Cross is a place and a very nice community not a plot.
Development will be allowed on Gerrards Cross land that is already marked for development potential.
The local authority have stated that Gerrards Cross have enough potential development land to see them until at least 2026 without using any greenbelt land.
JSI are offering greenbelt land in Gerrards Cross
There is a lot of other green belt land in Gerrards Cross.
Question:-
If Gerrards Cross needs greenbelt land for development after 2026 will they
a) deal with a Gerrards Cross land owner/developer/ voter/community member, ?
b) Try and deal with multiple small investors in Asia who expect to make a huge profit and may have moved, died, or lost their documents?
Supplementary question. On a scale of 1-100 what do you think are the chances that JSI will still exist in 2026 or even in 2015 ? I have an opinion on this
[Angela P] If the mighty steadfast Singapore government can change its mind like, what about a more laxed UK government?]
You miss a key point. JSI profit projections are based on current UK building land values. What keeps building land values so high in the UK is the protected land policies that you claim will easily be reversed. If Greenbelt policy is relaxed then the market will be flooded with cheap greenbelt land. You still cant make money. It wont happen because In the UK the politicians will get voted out of power if they allow the greenbelt to be developed in places like Surrey or Gerrards Cross without a very good reason.
UK has 350 times the land area of Singapore with 10 times the population. There is a lot of empty land in the UK. Some land is marked for development with local developers. Some is protected land . JSI sell protected land because they can buy it cheaply because it cannot be developed. It is your choice if you choose to buy that land from JSI but at least accept it is land unsuitable for development.
Louis says:
November 27, 2010 at 12:33 am (UTC 8)
Steve,
Can you post the links here? Yes, it is Shrimps Field, Brighton Rd, Kingswood, Surrey. However, I did see some advertisement being put up for the sale of shrimps field, not too sure whether it is the same piece of land.
http://www.buildinglanduk.co.uk/land-plot-sale.asp?landno=927-Surrey
Steve F says:
November 27, 2010 at 12:19 pm (UTC 8)
Louis
Yes I saw that advert as well. But they make clear the land has no planning permission and as always quote the proximity to important things without saying its protected land that has been rejected as housing land by the local authority.
This statement on Shrimps Field Surrey was made in 2008. If anyone has a later statement from any UK planning or regulatory authority or recognised body reversing this (as the Jardin Smith salespeople claim ) then I will publicly apologise. If not then Jardin Smith continue to promote this land while knowing that Local Authority has said it is excluded from forward planning activities. I stand by my position that this is protected land as stated by the local authority and will not be developed.
Strategic Housing Land Availability Assessment
http://www.reigate-banstead.gov.uk/Images/Final%20SHLAA%20Document_tcm9-32460.pdf
From Page 33 of this report
“Those sites excluded on the grounds of flooding and open space deficiency are contained in Table 9″
Line one of table 9 shows:-
Ref: KBH1
Address: Shrimps Field, Chipstead Lane & Brighton
Road, Kingswood
5 HA
Current Use:Vacant Field
Open Space Deficiency: Yes
Louis says:
November 27, 2010 at 4:28 pm (UTC 8)
hi Steve,
Thanks for the document. It seems you are very familiar with the operation of UK local governments. What does ‘open space deficiency’ actually mean? Does it mean if they build fewer houses then it is ok? Sorry if the question is stupid.
The document also says it is a living document subject to review every year. Is there a way to obtain the latest document for 2009 or 2010?
Another question is why do you say it is protected land? I supposed those classified as protected land are listed in table 8?
Thanks.
Steve F says:
January 12, 2011 at 12:30 pm (UTC 8)
A freedom of information request has been raised against Reigate and Banstead council on the land at Shrimps Field that Jardin Smith offer in Asia.
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/jardin_smith_shrimps_field_poten
A response should come within 20 days.
Given the abysmal performance and loss of capital from other companies offering UK Land Banking plots in Asia I dont see this as being any different but lets wait and see what the response is.
Steve F says:
November 28, 2010 at 10:38 pm (UTC 8)
Louis
Open space deficiency means that the local area does not have sufficient open or green spaces to meet with UK Government guidelinefor “green lung” and recreation open spaces in developed areas and further development should not be allowed.
Reigate and Banstead council called for a housing land availability survey in 208 for houses to be developed up until 2026. Many potential sites were submitted. A company called WS Planning submitted Shrimps Field Kingswood for consideration as a potential housing development site around June 2008. You can see this submission here on Page 4.
http://www.reigate-banstead.gov.uk/Images/SHLAA%202009%20-%20Appendices%201-20_tcm9-37300.pdf
The previoulsy mentioned report in Dec 2008 is the reponse which rejected this site. There is no need to review open space deficiency annually unless the government policy changes . Open space cant magically increase – if you have a deficiency it can only get worse unless you knock down buildings.
WS PLanning list Jardin Smith as a customer on their web site so I am sure WS must have informed JSI of the Open Space Deficiency issue on Shrimps Field in Dec 2008.
The local people in Kingswood had a protest site against JSI when they were called Jardine Smith. That was taken down some time ago presumably because once the open space deficiency was declared the threat of development was removed.
People seem to take my comments personally because they dont match what they want to believe. You do not have to believe me you can do the same research I have done or contact the local authority directly. They can also confirm the current land status for you.
http://www.reigate-banstead.gov.uk
contactus@reigate-banstead.gov.uk
My opinion based on available data is that Shrimps Field cannot be developed . Despite the many claims on this site that this opinion may be wrong no actual data has been presented to support an alternate view.
Steve F says:
November 28, 2010 at 10:57 pm (UTC 8)
Louis
You can find the latest copy of the Reigate and Banstead Strategic Housing Land Availability Assessment report here. This site also describes the process.
http://www.reigate-banstead.gov.uk/planning/planning_policies/local_development_framework/ldf_evidence_base/strategic_housing_land_availability_assessment_shlaa/index.asp
The August 2009 version has the same status fror Shrimps Field . It would appear that the 2010 version is not out yet.
Joe P says:
December 1, 2010 at 4:31 pm (UTC 8)
Helen
You made the followingcomment
[Quote]“I read in the latest report by South Bucks it says on page 35 that Gerrards Cross is indeed a plot of land in the focus for development.”[/Quote]
On page 16 of the same report:
The Green Belt boundary be strongly protected, with most new development accommodated on previously developed land, within existing settlements. The towns and villages in South Bucks will be high quality places, surrounded by protected landscape.
On Page 20 and 29 of this report:
Protect and positively manage the Green Belt.
No amendments required to the Green Belt boundary in
the period to 2026 (see Spatial Strategy).
On Page 24:
future development needs in the period to 2026 can be accommodated without the need for the release of
Green Belt land.
Page 31
to help avoid unsustainable commuting pressures and protect the Green Belt, no new greenfield employment sites are proposed.
Page 43
to ensure that effective use is made of this land and to help protect the Green Belt.
The Land that JSI is selling in South Bucks (Gerrards Cross) is Green Belt.
Joe P
hopeful says:
December 7, 2010 at 2:54 am (UTC 8)
Can it be concluded that JSI has the intention to cheat investors then. Can they be collectively taken to court by investors to demand for money back since they painted a false picture with the intention to get investors to fall into the trap? Shouldnt investors take action now when the company is still around, rather than just complain here. What if the company really gets clammed down by authorities, will the investors get anything back?
Philip says:
December 13, 2010 at 1:23 am (UTC 8)
I bought a plot of land from Jardin Smith 2 years ago – Fontley farm house, Titchfield, Fareham. Any one bought the same piece of land? Any update on the status of planning permission?
The salesperson that serve me has quitted and the one that serve me only call me when she wants to sell me new plot of land. When I wanted to get updates on the land that i bought, I could not get any which piss me off totally.
once_bitten_twice_shy says:
December 13, 2010 at 9:13 pm (UTC 8)
I attended one of their seminars last week. apparently, they’re playing hard to get nowadays.refused to lower the price. the price quoted to me was totally not consistent. I met another potential investor at the lift lobby and was told that the price that was quoted to me is actually higher.
can play price warfare. well, i guess that’s sales.
Philip,
well, not surprising that the salesperson only call you when she wants to sell you something else.
But the surprising part is that they did not even have any updates for you.
well guys, what about this statement from their website?
“Gerrard’s Cross is a beautiful suburban town situated in the west side of London. It is widely considered to be the most expensive place to live in England apart from the centre of London. The local railway station enjoys nearly 70 services a day into central London. The site adjoins the London M25 orbital motorway and is only 13 miles from the busiest airport in the world, Heathrow. It has excellent road networks into London itself, particularly along the A40. London and the South East need more than 1.4 million new houses by 2020, the highest housing target in England. South East Buckinghamshire Council, consider Gerrard’s Cross to be one of the areas where development will take place.”
Joe P says:
December 21, 2010 at 6:40 am (UTC 8)
Some useful statistics which show what the real chances of development of Greenbelt in Gerrards Cross. Gerrards Cross is in an administrative region called South Bucks. South Bucks have already said that there will be no development of greenbelt before 2026 . Here they confirm the following.
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/green_belt_monitoring_report
Question: How much greenbelt land has been released for housing in the last 20 years ?
Answer: Zero
Question: How much of South Bucks area is greenbelt ?
Answer: 87%
So not only have South Bucks been able to meet all of their housing needs in one of the biggest housing booms in history from 13% of their land they can continue to do so for at least another 16 years. Even then they have a huge pool of Greenbelt land to choose from.
Joe P says:
February 22, 2011 at 11:04 am (UTC 8)
Jardin Smith have submitted a planning application for Shrimps Field .
You can see it here:-
http://www.reigate-banstead.gov.uk/Planit2/planit2.jsp?Controller=p2Controller&Action=FindApplicationByRefvalAction&REFVAL=10/02195/OUT
Look at the various tabs and you can see the process outlined plus the correspondence recieved.
Please be aware that the submission of a planning application has no bearing on a successful outcome or is no proof that a site can be developed. As an example anyone can pay a fee and submit a loan request for a billion dollars from the Bank. That request is no proof of status or ability to pay until it gets approved.
Steve L says:
October 24, 2011 at 6:54 pm (UTC 8)
The planning permission of Reigate by JSI was rejected by the council on 8th July 2011.
New Investor says:
March 22, 2011 at 8:47 am (UTC 8)
Hi Guys,
its really good to know about so much things from just reading the thread. I was one of the new investors they call up to sell me new plot of land at Romford. The offer and returns seems really good. But could i check if anyone who bought the land with JSI got rezone? Thank you
Steve F says:
March 27, 2011 at 9:08 am (UTC 8)
Can anyone advise the location or address of the JSI Romford land ?
Elyonn says:
March 27, 2011 at 10:03 pm (UTC 8)
I just paid a downpayment for the Romford land. After reading all the comments, I wonder whether I should stop paying the balance 90%
Joe P says:
March 28, 2011 at 12:43 am (UTC 8)
Elyonn
If you dont know anything about the planning status of the land get your deposit back and check with Havering Planning first – however you will need to tell them the reference or location of the Land. Havering is the adminstrative authority for Romford.
planning@havering.gov.uk
You might also want to look at the status of Jardin Smith Gerrards Cross land to give you an idea of the kind of problems you can have.
Peter B says:
March 30, 2011 at 3:23 pm (UTC 8)
Jardin Smith are offering land in Lower Bedfords Road so it may be the same land but if not this will give indicative values for green belt land in that area.
There was a recent transaction for Romford Green Belt Land. Anyone know what JSI are charging per Sq Metre for this land ?
169 acres was offered for sale in 2008 for 2 Million UKP. Assuming the sales price was achieved that would equate to a raw land value of S$6 per square metre or S$5 per square yard.
This is from the 2008 sales brochure description.
http://media.primelocation.com/SPGR/SPCF/SPCF_CHM080212/BROCH_01.PDF
Location
———
Upper Bedfords Farm, Lower Bedfords Road , Romford, Essex , RM1 4DQ.
Upper Bedfords Farm lies approximately three miles north of Romford, approximately 12 miles to the north east of London.
Planning
———
The land is situated within the Metropolitan Green Belt as defined in the London Borough of Havering Unitary
Development Plan (adopted March 1993). Lot 1 is included within the Havering Ridge Area of Special Character and policies proposing improved bridleway and footpath access.
Steve F says:
March 30, 2011 at 9:08 pm (UTC 8)
Hello Elyonn
The Jardin Smith JSI web site talks about the land being in Romford. Lower Bedfords Road is actually to the north of Romford but is in the London Borough of Havering. Large sections of Havering are parkland and 23 square miles (60 km2) (more than half the borough) is Metropolitan Green Belt protected land.
Looking at Google maps Lower Bedfords Road runs through a large section of greenbelt.
Data from another site is says that bulk Greenbelt Land in Havering was selling for about 2 – 3 UK Pounds per square metre in 2008. I cant see it would have changed much now but maybe land banking companies have pushed the price up a bit.
How big is your plot and how much are you paying for it ?
Giggs says:
April 2, 2011 at 10:50 pm (UTC 8)
I just attended one of their seminar today. Was quoted S$300 per sq m. They offer a 5% ~ 15% discount depending on the number of plot you buy.
If they are buying the land for 2~3 UKP in 2008, how much profit are they making from these investor!
Richard L says:
April 3, 2011 at 12:35 am (UTC 8)
Just attended JSI function.
They are offering plots of 100sqm at SGD30k.
Offering discounts of up to 20% (if you buy 3 lots).
I was not paying enough attention so I did not know the exact location. Things I remembered, ~4km from Romford station but about 1~2km from 2 other station.
About 1km from Harold & nearest Tesco.
Shaped like one of the block offered – about 20acre.
I think it is the second from the left on the brochure…
No, I did not buy…
Personally, I do believe in land banking but it takes in depth personal knowledge to do so successfully.
Disclosure: I do own a piece of agricultural land in Malaysia – held it > 10 years and it has since become eligible to be re-zoned (as the land around it has already done so & developed). Yes raw land prices has appreciated 10x but my 2 partners & I are just sitting on it… Paid RM70k/acre then… (Not RM70k per 100sqm!)
Peter B says:
April 3, 2011 at 10:42 am (UTC 8)
Hello Giggs / Richard
Depending on exactly what they paid that would be a 1000% to 2000% gross markup. This is pretty typical for companies offering UK land plots. Nice margins if you can get it.
I’m curious to know did they make any promises or indications of the prospects of the land beyond suggesting that it was near to important things?
Did they suggest the likely development period was ?
Thanks
Richard L says:
April 3, 2011 at 12:56 pm (UTC 8)
I am not sure what you mean by promises or prospects.
There was no time frame given other than a chart showing optimistically what would happen if there was a re-zoning around year 6 – that is where you are supposed to get a 400% profit.
In addition they have a vote at 15 year to sell regardless and a compulsory sell/exit at either 25/30 year even if there was no re-zoning.
Now, they are going hi-tech, using Google Earth to show you the surrounding areas. High lighting the Romford center, Romford Railway station, Harold Hills & nearby Tesco.
They keep mentioning WS Planning as handling the re-zoning application. Maybe I/someone should check WS Planning’s record as they seems to be quite active as a reference…
Since I owned land in Malaysia, I asked about annual fees and upkeep expenses but the saleslady went blank! Plus we never sub-divided the land until we are ready to develop or split/sub-sell so the idea of immediate sub-division was a turn off for me instead of a plus. Having been offered land under water (literally) and land subject to government compulsory acquisition in the past, I was leery from the start. BTW, those are typical Malaysian land stunts – I had accompanied my Dad to physically check out the land (& asked neighbors) and followed up at the local land & survey offices, to uncover these gotchas… My father never buys land he has never seen and checked with official authority. And I guess he can be considered a small time land banker – for his own small property development company.,
All I can say about owning land is:
1. The % appreciation is much higher than housing,
2. Lot’s of tricky requirements
3. Difficult to get loan – only use $ you have no need for many years
4. Almost a must to have some trusted person to attend to the land on the spot – squatters are a real threat (to your title).
Peter B says:
April 3, 2011 at 2:20 pm (UTC 8)
There is no Jardin Smith planning application currently for Romford. WS planning are processing a Jardin Smith planning application for Shrimps Field. A look at the Reigate planning web site shows serious objections (because it is after all Green Belt). WS Planning will be paid to submit the application and can submit all the planning applications they want. It is the actual chance of success that counts. The cost of the planning submission for Shrimps Field is around UKP 10K which is less than the profit margin on a single 100 SqM plot. Some might see it as an investment to convince investors and authority of genuine intent.
The UK planning process can take several years with several levels for appeal. There is nothing to stop someone declaring a planning application in process even with no chance of success.
Ah Huat says:
April 4, 2011 at 1:34 am (UTC 8)
The ultimate good margine really justify the $100 gift voucher.
And with such good investment return, probably I wouldn’t be sharing with so many (unknown).
Panita says:
April 24, 2011 at 2:15 pm (UTC 8)
A what do they know request has been submittd for Jardin Smith Romford Site. You can see it here.
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/jardin_smith_bedfords_road_romfo
I see the JSI Malaysia web site is now claiming to be the “offical site” for Jardin Smith International . Have they moved from Singapore ?
Both the Singpaore and Malaysia do not feature any phone or office address in the contact details. Only email address. A lack of contact details is an identified indicator for Land Banking scams so they really should fix that quickly if they have moved.
yves says:
May 4, 2011 at 12:37 am (UTC 8)
JSI agreed to refund me $3000 in Nov 2010 after I told them that I wanted to quit. I was lucky to get my money back. I decided to quit after reading up in the internet on land banking scandals.
I 100% believe JSI is a land banking scam company. Many land banking company failed in UK and Europe and started to scam the Asian people money. MAS should start the investigation on JSI immediately.
I believe JSI as a land banking scam company will become a headline once they shut down and pull out from Singapore and Malaysia.
Somebody in Singapore really need to blow the whistle on JSI before more investor going to lost all their money to the scam company.
Becareful with your own investment money.
yves says:
May 4, 2011 at 12:39 am (UTC 8)
JSI is a scam time bomb in Singapore and Malaysia. Just wait and see…..
yves says:
May 4, 2011 at 12:49 am (UTC 8)
See yourselves the April 21 2011 UK news reporting that the UK Romford land that JSI is promoting now to Singapore and Malaysia investors, the land prices are marked up 5000% from the price that they paid in 2008.
This news was real as the the news inside was even quoting the estate agents Strutt&Parker that sold the land to JSI.
The news is saying that JSI even start selling the UK Romford land to China investors now. God bless Asian people.
http://www.london24.com/news/havering_green_belt_for_sale_in_asia_1_878264
Helpless Lady says:
August 15, 2011 at 10:53 pm (UTC 8)
I had just bought a plot of land @ Romford at JSI event held in Goodwood Park Hotel, Singapore on 31 July 2011 & had paid the full amount of $20K 10% via credit card & 90% via cheque… the cheque was collected by the them at the evening from my place. I initially find it odd that they seems to rush into collecting the $ but the very friendly & seems honest staff explains it’s bcos it’s month end so he had to submit the payment 1st thing the next morning. Anyone can help me by telling me what to do next? After reading the posts on JSI really scares me & I hope to get back my hard-earned money as it took me to save such amount… I actually intend to have the $ leaps to a bigger sum for my girl’s future education fund! To-date, I had yet to get my title deed, that’s trigger me to search online for their contacts & here I see so much negative comments about UK landbanking.
Frankie says:
November 27, 2011 at 11:34 am (UTC 8)
Investment Company knows human’s weakpoint _ ” Greedy ” , Ask yourself if such good return can be true, Everyone can be rich so easy and no need to work hard . Always remind yourself, there is no free lunch , unless you work for it.
Joe P says:
May 18, 2011 at 12:59 pm (UTC 8)
What do they know for Romford has been responsed to by the UK Local Authority.
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/jardin_smith_bedfords_road_romfo
The key points are:-
All land to the north of Lower Bedfords Road and land to the south, east of the Rise Park housing area is designated as Green Belt. There has been no change in the policy relating to Green Belt since 2008.
It is not known what piece of land Jardin Smith is selling. There
have been no approaches to remove the Green Belt status of land on Lower Bedfords Road.
There are no plans to change the Green Belt boundary in Havering.
The Green Belt is confirmed in the Council’s Local Development Framework (LDF) and is not due to be reviewed.
The Government has not made any indication that Green Belt would be relaxed in the future. National planning policy restricts development in the green belt except where very special
circumstances can be demonstrated.
Joe P says:
July 12, 2011 at 12:27 am (UTC 8)
The Jardin Smith application for planning permission at Shrimps Field has been firmly rejected.
You can see the rejection notice here
Here are the rejection reasons in summary
1: Inappropriate development in the greenbelt
2: Would urbanise a rural area
3: Harm the setting of an area of great landscape value
4: Unsustainable location
5: Non-affordable housing
6: No contribution to mitigate the harmful impact
For anyone familiar with UK planning law this rejection was a certainty. The question that should be asked is why would Jardin Smith ever have suggested to investors that this land had potential for development.
linkysw says:
July 12, 2011 at 4:14 pm (UTC 8)
I am an investor from Walton International. Back in those days, people talked about Walton being a scam company, they have no track record etc. I was as fearful as you people here. I decided to give it a go since my money won’t make me more money in the bank. Besides, it takes courage to diversify. When I made the profits, those who claimed that my investment with Walton was rubbish came asking which other land is good to invest in.
My friends and family has got our returns from Walton and diversified our investment with Jardin Smith International. In fact, many Walton’s investors are with Jardin Smith now too. I am just waiting as usual. I do understand how you new investors feel.
DARE to try, people will stare at your amount of money in later years.
Besides, investment is really up to individual. You make the decision, you make the money. You let others make a decision, you can only watch others make money.
Joe P says:
July 13, 2011 at 3:29 pm (UTC 8)
This is a JSI thread. Your pitch sounds like a typical sales pitch = you cant win if you dont bet which is rubbish.
In investing and even gambling you only bet if you have a chance of winning. In investing you should consider how much money you will retain if you dont win.
Which sites have you and your friends made money on with Jardin Smith ?
Please be specific and name the JSI site you have made money on. If you have not made money when will your sites convert ?
None of the JSI sites have converted – none have potential to convert.
Those are the facts to date not silly sales slogans.
linkysw says:
July 13, 2011 at 3:42 pm (UTC 8)
Did you read properly? Made money from Walton.
Joan says:
July 13, 2011 at 4:03 pm (UTC 8)
This is hilarious. Joe P seems to be so quick to jump at JSI. To read from the last thread is really Walton investor. Obviously mr linkysw is waiting for JSI. Why JSI, anyone?
Joan says:
July 13, 2011 at 4:11 pm (UTC 8)
Hilarious. Joe P seems to be really anxious to jump on JSI and Walton Investor. So what if they make or don’t make. JSI is enemy? I have been to their events. They are pretty ok. Not my sort of investment though. My brother did invest with them on land and property. He has received cheques apparently from property he invested with them. he is also wondering why so many negative comments from the same few people here. Is there something we should know? thanks!
Joe P says:
July 13, 2011 at 7:59 pm (UTC 8)
Did you read properly this is a thread about JSI? No end plot investor has made money from JSI land banking sites.
Yes there is something you should know. JSI have traded UK greenbelt Land Plots for over 5 years through the biggest UK housing boom ever. Despite lots of wolly words they have no site conversions. None.
Please see the UK FSA landbanking video posted by the owner of this blog. 130 UK landbanking companies under investigation or closed down. Zero returns for end investors. Search for UK Land Banking in Google. What does that tell you about this business.
Again you say my brother, my friend ,my cousin got rich blah blah.
No actual site named no returns given. There have been no returns.
I deal in facts.
There have been zero investment returns from UK land plots sold under these schemes. A few investors have had their money returned by screaming loudly and early. If your “brother” is really invested I suggest he asks for his money back now.
Aries says:
October 12, 2011 at 3:53 pm (UTC 8)
My heart is very heavy now after reading all these emails thread for I bought a plot of land from JSI too (just last Wed to be exact).
I do believe that it is truth that land is scare but don’t understand about the greenbelt issue – how did JSI manage to buy land after land that is restricted by the UK gov and selling it to us consumers here in Asia.
If they are really faudrent, is there any way to claim our money back. Also, how do we bring JSI to justly.
Also, feel that the staff (are probably)not aware of the company position .
Empathy says:
October 13, 2011 at 10:52 am (UTC 8)
Aries,
i am puzzled but it behooves some of us really. How can you buy something which you haven’t done any research or due diligence on?
Did you say if they are fraudulent? I don’t know. But we know that they have marked up the land by 5000% as in the UK local news.
Most likely you have to wait another 20 to 25 years I think as mentioned by UK authorities to see approval of any kind for greenbelt land.
Steve F says:
October 15, 2011 at 8:47 pm (UTC 8)
Can i ask what plot you were sold ? How much did you pay ? Did they ever tell you that the land will be built on ?
Ask for your money back and say you will go to the CAD if you dont get it. They dont want a public fuss like Profitable Plots..
It is not illegal to sell green belt land. It can be sold and used for farming or recreational purposes. Farmland is worth a few dollars per square metre, recreational land is worth less. . Jardin Smith have convinced you that one day it can be built on and will be worth a lot of money. and persuaded you to pay many hundreds or thousands of dollars per square metre.
gary says:
October 13, 2011 at 3:37 am (UTC 8)
Jardin Smith pricing is still ok. recently i was invited to attend a seminar by another land banking company. the price is $26k for only 20 square meter. it is insane to pay for this kind of price. more ever i was told i will walk away with an ipad two but only given a swiss watch worth $20 but claim by the company said it worth $200.
The company a malaysian company Kelana something owned by a indian lady is all out to get singaporan money. $26k for 20 square meter? think abt it
Steve F says:
October 25, 2011 at 4:20 pm (UTC 8)
“Jardin Smith pricing is still ok.”
OK for what ? Are you saying if they sell you land worth S$6 for S$150 per square metre you are getting a good deal ?
Give me all of your money and I will give you 15% back . To be clear and with no small print required you will lose 85% That is still a much better investment return than you will get with JSI and you wont have to wait 10 years to understand how much money you have lost..
James says:
October 27, 2011 at 11:54 am (UTC 8)
Hello.. Really interesting thread here.. I did buy a small plot in gerrards cross through jsi.. Seems like it is becoming a mistake.. Great job on the info steve f.. Now the next question is who do we seek in jsi to effectively demand our hard earned money back and how should we go about it? Would not want to bark up the rotting tree.. A quick and perhaps detailed response is greatly appreciated
Steve F says:
November 3, 2011 at 5:35 pm (UTC 8)
If your land banking company is still trading there are a few avenues or approaches you can take. Land Banking companies can no longer advertise in main stream media so rely on word of mouth, referrals and cold calling. They do not want people making a fuss with the authorities or other potential customers. If avoidance of fuss requires them to refund a couple of customers they sometimes will do so. Asking for money back directly might work. I would suggest a calm an controlled approach initially with any statements made to you that may have misled you. If that doesn’t work you may want to try using the various consumer organisations to support you.
Like most investment schemes if everyone asks for their money back they cant pay so get in early.
WhereverILayMyHat says:
January 5, 2012 at 4:05 pm (UTC 8)
I’ve come in late into this thread but felt should share.
In 2008, I bought a plot for about RM60k from the Shrimp’s Field from Jardine Int, Malaysia Thought it was a way of getting my big toe into the international property maket. Soon after, another sales person wanted to meet me to introduce me to a member-get-member scheme they were running.
For the first time, I was shown the surveyor’s report, well rushed through really, and wanted time to digest it but was discouraged from reading it whilst being given a really hard sell push.
Fate stepped in when the salesperson knocked his coffee cup over and he had to go to the washroom to clean up, leaving the surveyor’s report on the table. I flipped to the report’s conclusion and basically (if I recall correctly), it stated along the lines that allegedly Shrimp’s Field was not a recommended buy!
On the salesperson’s return, I politely declined then immediately hounded Jardine to return my money, threatening to bring in Bank Negara. They returned it. Offered to re-sell it for me but I declined figuring it would be really bad karma.
I was lucky and thank the universe for looking after me!
Joe Piper says:
February 26, 2012 at 8:27 pm (UTC 8)
JSI are stating their first success at a site called Anlaby in the UK . Interestingly this site had never been offered on the JSI website last year. A little research on the internet shows that Jardin Smith bought a site with a church building on it and the plans are to knock the building down and build apartments. It is a small low value already built site . This is not a green belt conversion. It is a fairly standard and valid planning application for re-developing an existing site.
None of the green belt sites that JSI have offerd including Romford that Jardin Smith are currently promoting on their website have been submitted for planning approval and according to all reputable source none of the JSI greenbelt sites have any realistic chance of obtaining planning approval.
It would be interesting to know if any JSI investors in Asia were offered Anlaby.
third person opinion says:
February 27, 2012 at 2:56 pm (UTC 8)
joe wat r u exactly? dont you work? or is stalking jsi wat u r paid for? why r u always so quick to rebark others who speak up for jsi? if you haf a properly job, you will not be so free to keep following jsi news. sometimes the person who speaks the most, is the suspicious one.
WhereverILayMyHat says:
March 5, 2012 at 1:24 pm (UTC 8)
Third person, perchance Joe’s hit a sensitive nerve(s) obviously not to your liking?
thinks says:
March 3, 2012 at 7:27 pm (UTC 8)
joe rocks
Wannabe says:
March 7, 2012 at 5:30 am (UTC 8)
So much debating & negative responses about JSI.
I am curious to know
Why isn’t Singapore Government shutting them down if they are fraudulent?
Did anyone make profits from JSI after 2005? and how much? any Proof?
Why are those people replying in the threads stop responding to Joe comment?
Why is Joe so familiar with JSI projects? Where is Joe from ? What do you do for living?
Why isn’t anyone stand up firmly for JSI with evidence and proof?
jeff says:
March 13, 2012 at 4:18 pm (UTC 8)
The comments posted here by some of these people seem to be a little biased, obviously coming from those who work in this company.
It seems strange here, that although these people who claim that joe has something against the company; but yet somehow nobody is able to prove Joe’s comments wrong.
I would like to see someone who can prove his claims about this land banking investment wrong.
I stumbled upon this site when a friend recommended me to buy land from this company and it was then when a manager called me from the company to sell me a parcel of land in Romford at that time.
After reading all the comments and also doing my own due diligence, I thought that its best for me not to invest in something that I am not sure about despite the wonderful returns promised upon planning permission.
I believe that JSI has sold many projects as of date since they had started operating. I have asked them in regards to their processes in regards to planning permission of their previous projects and I never got a concrete answer from them justifying their work.
I followed my friend for an investment update in regards to his investment, but as much as I don’t want to say it, I feel sorry for my friend as the updates that were given to him were just tons and tons of articles from different websites showing how many houses are being built in the area.
I feel sorry for the people working there as they may not realize this as when their foreigner sales director starts telling the clients a pack of stories, they seem to agree with him. Maybe he is paid a lot of money to do this and therefore the client managers seem to agree and convince my friend that it is still a good investment despite what my friend asks.
Their UK director is very smart when it comes to avoiding all the questions that you ask and keeps beating around the bush and you can see that he is doing he’s very best not to show how angry he was. I was lucky because, my friend told him that I am his brother so the director had no choice but to answer me as he was behaving really suspicious when I started asking him valid questions. He could only answer but not show a single paperwork regarding it, I cannot remember his name, but he’s quite a seasoned and old chap who has no idea what he is talking about when it comes to land and development.
A few of the questions that I had asked which really ticked him off, things like
If JSI has sold many projects before, what is the current status on these projects at the moment?
My friend invested in Reigate and a few projects after that until I told him to stop doing it until he gets concrete answers.
What about the current projects that have been sold before this? Has any work been done? Have they attempted to apply for planning permission for the other projects? If so, is there any proof or is there any documentation that JSI can provide to the clients? Is there anything in black and white that can be provided by the company assuring to the investors that JSI is a genuine and legitimate company with the intentions to returns clients’ money unlike other scrupulous investment companies?
If you do good research, you will get valid answers.
If JSI was a company that they say they are, why can’t their planners WS Planning which their local and foreign director keeps boasting about give any comments about the work they have been doing in regards to all their other projects?
As of date, JSI has only submitted one planning permission for their site in reigate and obviously it was rejected. What about the other projects? Any news? I asked my friend whether has he got any written updates from the company until date. He’s answer is NO.
All the updates will be provided by the company on a personal basis and obviously all their foreigner directors have changed faces many times.
I have decided to respond to this thread when I met my friend the other day and he told me, that JSI has got planning permission for one of their projects and all the investors will be getting their money soon. Obviously, it was not funny when he told me that I should know where to put my money like him.
Joe’s comment is right when he said that these Anlaby site is NOT a site that their land that has got planning permission. The building was bought with PLANNING PERMISSION and how can the salesperson of JSI mislead clients that way?
The salesperson who sold him land is telling him that it was their land that got planning permission. I feel sorry for my friend, as just because she wears a skimpy attire, very tall and beautiful and he’s single and old, I guess it’s what these people fall for as he seems to believe the sales girl more then anybody else foolishly investing his money without getting anything so far from JSI from his invesments, Not even an update which he could show me or justify to me.
What’s worse, my friend and not only him, many others have NOW got involved in another scheme that is promoted by JSI, – AGARWOOD TREES! The company who could not get returns through their land is now getting these same clients to invest more of their money in something even more unstable.
This I realized when I recently spoke to him about his investment made in edgeworth.
My friend has showed me and keeps trying to win my consent that this is a good investment , both land and trees – but when I see his papers, it is very obvious that this are both the same companies working the same way just selling different product.
They use a company name Asia plantation Singapore and It is told that, the company is regulated in Singapore by the authorities and also is part of a company called Asia plantation capital. Whats amiss is that, a lot of things are different between the two companies including the agreements. It is obvious, what JSI did with their land, buy it very cheap and sell it high. The same is with their trees, if you buy the trees directly from the company in the UK, it is MUCH cheaper as you can check for yourself. These people are currently using the same office as jardin smith in kuala lumpur selling these investments.
I am told by my friend that this agarwood investment has a track record and has provided clients back with money. He says his manager has told him that there have been people who received money from this company. Yet again, I ask him to show it to me, nothing yet. The only thing that he could show me was his agreement and his timber certificate. I was shocked when not only I saw the agreement, let alone the certificate. The timber certificate looks like it was made by the company and there is no way to check with the authorities anywhere.
A lot of people keep falling into the traps of these sort of lucrative schemes. If a company is genuine and probably JSI is, I think they should be able to back up everything they say with a piece of paper at least or from other authorities or their vendors etc.
The company should be open and transparent with the way they do business. The company should not be hesistant to show any of their documents if a client requests.
If they are truly a genuine company, there should be nothing to hide and all the relevant documents should be open to those who invest for their assurance.
Please don’t be misled. As a person from the legal background, kindly read the documents properly as once you have signed it, there is nothing that you can do about it.
Investments schemes such as the trees are not regulated in certain countries like Malaysia and will be forced to shut down if they operate openly. Normally these sorts of companies operate discreetly so that it doesn’t fall into the eye of the authorities.
For those who have bought land previously from JSI, I really do hope my friend gets his money back and prove me and others like Joe wrong.
For the staff that are working for JSI or this sort of insecure investments s, whether you know it or not, don’t be duped by the people in your company and making you the one to be misleading the local people into putting their money into something you are not sure of yourself just for your greed.
Because, normally when something happens, the smartest people are those who are getting you to do the job and do not meet the clients as they will be the first to walk away without you knowing as the client will only come back to you first.
Joe P says:
March 17, 2012 at 8:17 am (UTC 8)
[@third person]joe wat r u exactly?
Male, English , Middle aged.
[@third person dont you work?
Yes , full time in IT management for a Global MNC.
[@third person or is stalking jsi wat u r paid for?
I post once or twice a month on UK land banking. There are hundreds of posts added to the internet each month by sponsored posters acting for land banking companies. Thesesponsored posts talk about how you can huge returns and how great theseland banking companies are. These sponsored sites do not allow comments or criticism. I try and provide some balance to that
[@third person why r u always so quick to rebark others who speak up for jsi? if you haf a properly job, you will not be so free to keep following jsi news. sometimes the person who speaks the most, is the suspicious one.
I am very ashamed at the way UK Land Banking Plots are promoted in Asia. I want to provide a balance to the torrent of misleading information that is used to promote land banking. There are posts on the internet stating that returns of 1000% or more are easily possible in a short period of time.This is not true.
It is not illegal to buy or sell UK land plots. But the prospects for these land plots are always misstated. It is a fact that the most likely outcome for an investment in UK Greenbelt land plots is a loss of 100% of your investment. Having shown willingness to buy a UK Land Banking plot you may be encouraged to buy other poor investments. Later on you may even be offered chargeable services to recover your investment.
So where allowed I try and point to real facts and points of authority to allow people to be informed and make their own decisions and choices.
Lee says:
March 26, 2012 at 2:28 pm (UTC 8)
O..dear! Got to read all this too late. Attended a session last Sat. at MBS with my family. Paid deposit totally $2970, by credit card for 2 plots. They quoted 33k for each plot. 5% discount for 1 plot, 10% if u take 2 &15% if u buy 3 plots. We are suppose to complete d sales (paying the balance of $56,430) at their office this coming Wed. nite. Can anybody advise what should we do? Any possibility of getting back our deposit? Thank you in advance.
Joe P says:
April 1, 2012 at 1:00 pm (UTC 8)
Which site did you buy ? You can always ask for your money back.
Chris K. says:
April 1, 2012 at 10:59 pm (UTC 8)
Lee, did you get your deposit back?
I attended the same session at MBS with my wife and paid a deposit of $1568 by credit card for 1 plot.
And like you we found out on the internet that greenbelt lands will never be rezoned as residential land.
We went to the office last Wed to demand our deposit back but they insisted that their compliance officer is busy closing cases for the Romford plots.
We will meet them again this Tue.
Lee says:
April 3, 2012 at 1:21 pm (UTC 8)
Hi Chris, due to other commitments, we did not go to their office, as planned last Wed. We have yet to approach them for refund as we want to hear out more advice before we make our move.
Chris K. says:
April 3, 2012 at 4:07 pm (UTC 8)
Hi Lee, I’m meeting their compliance officer tonight to try and get back my deposit.
Lee says:
April 3, 2012 at 4:15 pm (UTC 8)
Chris, Good luck to you. Pls keep us posted.
Joe P says:
April 1, 2012 at 1:01 pm (UTC 8)
Which site did you buy ? You can always say you made a mistake and ask for your money back.
Lee says:
April 2, 2012 at 11:12 am (UTC 8)
Thanks Joe. It is Lower Bedford Road, Romford (West Site). We will definitely try to get our money back.
Mary Lim TH says:
April 2, 2012 at 10:18 am (UTC 8)
My husband and I purchased a plot from JSI back in 2007 during one of their seminars and lately I have received call from them about their site.
We went down eventually as my husband travels a fair bit and they informed us that our site has not been granted planning yet. They were detailed with their explanation about the planning regulations. I could not understand it all as some of the reports shown to us were quite technical.
I did a little research online about the changes about the planning policies to get a better grip on my hard earned monies. There are indeed changes coming about. How soon, we wouldn’t know. Anyway, we knew that when we bought this. It was going to be a long term investment and we had to wait. So for those who are impatient or wish to make a fast buck, this isn’t for you.
Interestingly I came across some forums and found the same Joe P claiming to be resident of quite a few of JSI’s sites. Joe P, are you really staying there or are you in Asia as you mentioned in this site?
My advice to anyone venturing into this kind of investment is “open your eyes, do your research before committing.”
My husband and I dabble in the stock markets and we have a house in Malaysia and UK. We do not put all our eggs in one basket and we have no major commitments as our two boys are now working.
Just remember that with any investment, there is a level of risk. Do make sure you are comfortable with this before you proceed.
Mary Lim
Joe P says:
April 3, 2012 at 12:55 am (UTC 8)
@Lee
Good luck with your refund. Romford is a greenbelt site so highly unlikely to get planning permission. Greenbelt land in the Romford area is worth about S$5-S$15 per Sq metre on the open market depending on a few factors.
@Mary
Not sure what you mean by claiming to be a resident. I move between the UK and Asia on business but I am from the UK .
UK greenbelt Land Banking plots have had a zero success for conversion so far in around 10 years that they have been offered as an investment “opportunity”. The historic data for companies operating in this segment suggest they all fail eventually and investors lose most or all of their money. Your company might be the black swan that proves the data wrong but i doubt it.
The best way to be informed on any major decision is to have at least 3 independent data points. If all your information is coming from JSI or related sources then really you only have one data point. It doest matter how much they update you. Its still one data point. You might want to research UK land banking in google and try and understand why your site is different from those that are in trouble or have failed . You can also contact the relevant UK local authority for your site to get their opinion.
Good luck with your investment.
jeff says:
April 3, 2012 at 12:17 pm (UTC 8)
I attended their event recently at Sunway Resort Hotel.
Jardin Smith International are no longer allowed to market their land in Malaysia openly. They are not allowed to advertise and neither are they allowed to have any public events anymore like they normally do in hotel.
They now operate openly under a company called Asia Plantation Singapore and most of the employees that were selling land is now in the business of selling trees. The owner of Asia Plantation & Jardin Smith is the same.
As they know they cant sell land anymore. They now sell trees promising ridiculous returns to investors who had bought land from them and new clients. Please bear in mind. This trees that they are selling has no concrete evidence of returns given. I was told that many clients have received. But if you called the original company, they say no AND THERE IS NO GUARANTEE if your TREES DO NOT HARVEST ANYTHING AT ALL.
If you had got an update for your land, from an elderly english guy. I think his name is richard. He didnt give me his card the last time, but then again. Please do verify his facts as most of it are not as what you think it would be. He has a way of getting around facts. Not sure if he is still there anymore.
All the planning permission documents shown by them are, consented by government and are not done by Jardin Smith..
Jardin Smith – it likely has any chance but i do hope they get it.
But then , if you invested with them they should be able to provide you with documents showing what they have done with your land and not merely showing you documents of what others have done.
Kindly becareful of what youre investing in, if a company is genuine. They would be able to provide you every single detail without hesitation and could be verified by third parties.
Like i have mentioned before, being from the legal background, this is how you differentiate between good companies and bad companies.
It is because of companies like this, spoil the reputation of genuine companies.
I am glad that they have stopped selling land, but now …. its back to the same thing ….
Same people, but now its just trees. I am not worried about the land part, what worries me now more is how they operate through Asia Plantation.
Hope they deliver to clients for this one. A seven year investment that may not have anything at all if the trees dont harvest. – Now thats a big risk!
Bitten once says:
April 3, 2012 at 2:32 pm (UTC 8)
To those who wants a refund…
Pls do it fast. There’s a fair trading act in sg for consumer protection. For those direct selling, there’s a 7 day cooling off period, excluding weekends, to claim your refund. The company involved will try to avoid such claims and drag the 7 day period, making it null so you can’t refund anymore.
In general some companies they play dirty tactic, they dun inform you of the cooling period, but slip the form into your contract envelope. If you are not inform of the cooling off period by your sales rep, your cooling off period does not start from the day you sign but from the day you find out about the cooling off period.
There are some who seek help from lawyers to claim back their money under this fair trading act. Those who were not informed and it lapsed more than 7 days, and some were not given the form to opt out within the 7 days also seek help from lawyers. This happened with the time share companies. I believe JSI will also have cooling off period becos it is a direct selling company.
I was once caught by a company playing this trick. However i managed to settle it for a little price.
I was once invited to JSI too, but i didn’t buy anything.
Lee says:
April 3, 2012 at 4:05 pm (UTC 8)
Hi Joe, though yet to get our refund, we must say a big thank you to you. It is people like you, who dare to speak up that makes this a better world!
JSI is very persistent. My wife & I were courted separately for almost a year and several months respectively.
They made us believed they just want us to get to know them ( a newly established company dealing with overseas properties). Nothing was mentioned about land banking until we agreed to attend. That was two days before we attend the session.
With hindsight, I should have done some research before attending! If I have done my due diligence, I would not have attended.
They were never pushy. But they made you believed the plots were selling like hotcakes. Decide fast or you missed the boat! Another smart tactic they employed was that, because the plots were selling so fast but they have to leave some for other investors, we were offered one plot only! However, if we want, they can try to talk to their superior. Sure enough, they came back with good news. We ended up buying two plots.
They also never come straight with the amount required for investment. 100k was the amount they kept mentioning. As we were perceived to expect the investment amount to be 100k or more, when we were finally told its 33k, psychologically, we were made to think its cheap. We were even prepared to buy 3 plots. That would still be less than 100k!
Just take Romford (west site) as example. 20 acres is 871,200 sq ft. That is 80, 937 sq m. JSI bought it in 2008 for less than S$6 psm. Add in other costs(excluding subdividing cost), they would have forked out around half a million only! They are now selling it for around S$297 to S$300 psm. That is almost 5000% marked up!
Assuming, they do retain 20% (which I doubt) and they sold off the other 80%, they would have grossed S$19 million at least!
There is no incentive for them to push through the “rezoning”. Selling off the site after rezoning would give them only a fraction of what they have already made!
Chris K. says:
April 3, 2012 at 9:51 pm (UTC 8)
I go on record to say that this matter with Jardin Smith International is settled amicably.
Lee says:
April 5, 2012 at 11:04 am (UTC 8)
We write to say that we were emotional with our fanciful remarks and the matter with JSI has been resolved to our satisfaction.
Jardin Smith International Pte Ltd says:
April 5, 2012 at 12:21 pm (UTC 8)
To all readers of this forum,
Jardin Smith International would like to clarify a comment made in this site by one individual named Jeff. (Full name and particulars not supplied.)
Jeff claims that Jardin Smith International (JSI) and Asia Plantation Capital (APC) are the same company. For the record straight (JSI) is in no way related to APC. We are a Singaporean company which sells land and property and they are a company from the United Kingdom that own and manage plantations around the world.
Jeff’s confusion probably arises because APC has agreements with many third party independent marketing companies selling their products on an agency basis around the world. JSI have been helping APC to market their products in Asia in particular on this agency basis.
We hope this clarifies the situation.
In the meantime, if any of you (Jeff in particular) have any further queries please contact us at info@jsi.com.sg.
Alternatively visit APC at their website:
http://www.asiaplantationcapital.com
The Management
Jardin Smith International Pte Ltd
Jeff says:
April 6, 2012 at 12:49 pm (UTC 8)
Jardin Smith International.(JSI)
Thank you for your clarification. It is nice to see the management responding to a thread when there are so many claims/accusations made against Jardin Smith.
While you are at it, maybe you could also reply to all the other comments and put your clients and the public at ease.
Perhaps i may have gotten my facts wrong as maybe your employees have misrepresented people the wrong way.
I speak because It was the same person who sold me land before carries an APC Name Card at the moment from your organisation and it is unfair of me to mention any names of your employees because they are just doing their job.
I have bought a plot before with JSI after recommendation from a friend a while back.
I am glad that JSI did not make it a hassle for me to get my money back as per what some may claim here.
Regarding your statement,
“JSI have been helping out APC to market in Asia”
I am glad that JSI is helping other companies to profit. Hope JSI can help the clients profit too.
If that is the case, is it legal for you to sell such an investment in Malaysia?
Is your investment covered by any legal bodies ?
Is your contract valid and what happens to a clients money if anything goes wrong ?
Since it is a UK company, are they registered here in Malaysia ?
Do they have a license to sell this investment ?
If i bought this investment from APC or JSI whoever it is , how am i protected if anything goes wrong ?
There is a lot of plantation companies in Malaysia, and many of them operate silently as they are not alloweed to operate in such way.
the only one or two who are operating with VALID license is such like company call
Country Heights Growers Scheme Berhad
which is Regulated by SSM in Malaysia
and has been providing clients money back ever since they have started.
I would like to extend my apologies to the readers in this forum if my statement was inaccurate in terms of the link between Jardin Smith International & Asia Plantation Capital.
It is my mistake for thinking that they are the same company as it is clarified by the management of Jardin Smith International that they are ONLY
helping Asia Plantation Capital to market their investment.
transparent says:
April 30, 2012 at 1:17 pm (UTC 8)
Verifying the information above.
Actually,
if you go to Jardin Smith Website and asia plantation singapore website ,
you will the following:
http://www.asiaplantationcapital.com/contact-us
Asia Plantation Capital Singapore
30 Raffles Place
#11-00, Chevron House
Singapore 048622
Tel: +65 6222 3386
Fax: +65 6221 2197
info@asiaplantationcapital.com
http://www.jsi.com.sg/contactus.php
Jardin Smith International Pte Ltd
Registered Address: 30 Raffles Place, Chevron House #11-00
Singapore 048622
Telephone: 65 6887 5335
FAX: 65 6887 5665
E-mail: info@jsi.com.sg
Although asia plantation is not part of Jardin Smith. Jardin Smith is their marketing agent for asia plantation capital. This can also be verified directly with the original company in the UK.
Thypically of Jardin Smith – Buy very cheap and mark up very high – selling to people by fools of greed.
In Malaysia, Jardin Smith is no longer allowed to sell land and this can be verified directly – with SSM malaysia.
The SSM (ROC) in Malaysia is also aware that the same people are now starting to sell another product under a similiar scheme.
in the name of ASIA PLANTATION MALAYSIA/SINGAPORE.
the plantation scheme is NOT REGULATED IN MALAYSIA and the SSM is warning people to not to fall for this schemes.
Simply because ,they are operating through technicalities which will in the end benefit them and not the buyers.
At the end of the day, is someone has bought somethign out of their own will then, theres nothing can be done.
So buyers beware and you can verify this information yourself.
The asia plantation group are the same people that is working for Jardin Smith International with a different mask this time.
I am guessing that these people must be getting paid really high for scamming people into investments out there.
They have been promised up to 600 to 700 hundred times in profit for when they sell the trees for the client. The same as they did for land.
If you are in Singapore or In Malaysia and have been to the a JArdin Smith presntation Before – it will most likely be the same as Asia Plantation Singapore – as their addresses verify the same.
Kindly beware and stop getting fooled by this people.
Some would wonder if the employees know this or not or they are just scammers as well like the owners themselvs looking for a quick buck.
Furthermore :
The FSA (Financial Security Authority) In the UK has released a statement about PLANTATION INVESTMENT SCHEMES
http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/consumerinformation/product_news/saving_investments/overseas_investment/index.shtml
Even the FSA website states:
REMEMBER: IF IT SOUNDS TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE, IT PROBABLY IS!
Kindly do your due diligence before investing in these companies.
cockanathan says:
April 8, 2012 at 2:52 pm (UTC 8)
If you want to invest in land, at least invest in the real thing — companies and actual productive land that is able to generate money NOW — rental properties, commercial & retail, industrial, mining etc. Not some airy-fairy talk-cock bedtime story from some cock-talking cockster.
If you’re so caught up in the angmoh sounding name, at least put your money into the real deal — Jardine Matheson which has been around for 180 years — they’re celebrating their 180th anniversary in 2012. Stocks like Jardine Matheson, Jardine Strategic, Hongkong Land, Mandarin Oriental, Astra (all part of Jardine) provide a globally diversified business portfolio including properties, land development, mining, natural resources, hospitality/hotels, serviced apartments, residential, office, retail, etc.
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Investing in UK Land | Den of The Lion Investor says:
March 19, 2008 at 12:47 am (UTC 8)
[...] mentioned in my previous post on Jardin Smith International Singapore that I will be elaborating more on UK land banking (or strategic land investment). Other than [...]